For Beatrice, my Buddy

Sorry to hear about your meds and how you're adjusting to them. I feel so selfish because it feels like my fault somehow that you're having to go through all this.

I keep re-reading your post. I know you didn't mean for me to find it....but then again, you're acquainted with my snooping skills, no?

November 25, 2003 - 02:00 PM Re: Elvish Titty-fight
Well, "high" has, for quite awhile, been associated with someone who is, relationally speaking, out-of-bounds. So hopefully "middle" around them will mean "my good buddy" and not "ohGodIsowanttograbyouandholdyouSOtightlyIloveyou" which is what it has been like.

Feh. Stupid fucking human condition.

I want to touch it, but of course that would be bad for my screen.

I also pulled out the copy of GEB you gave me and realized that you signed it "much love." Somehow I wanted to kiss the book, which was rather odd and unlike me.

But then, I was mad at you again about something on EZBoard, but I'm not sure why. Resentful, maybe about your single-handed line drawing. I may suggest you use I-statements with me in the future.

Last night I had a dream that you and your wife were getting married or having a renewal of vows or something. Everyone was in a big auditorium with movie theatre-style seats. You were sitting next to me! We held hands I and put my arm around you and we cuddled and then I felt ok, and then you had to get up and join the ceremony (so I guess the cuddling was during the preliminary stuff). I was glad because I thought it would be a bad thing if you missed your own wedding thing by being with me (understatement). I think if there's anything to read into the dream it's pretty clear to me.

Saw your post on the depression board today. A bit alarming! Actually, I was alarmed as soon as I saw you had joined the Depression tribe. My poor buddy! I just want to rest your head in my busom(sp?) and stroke your hair comfortingly. Hopefully therapy is helping you and you've found something you can work on/work through to put you in a better place in a deep way.

I guess when we talk next week (yay!) we'll have to figure out what to do about Tribe Net. I don't think you're being careless with things like the depression post because you want me to find them, but I do think we need some kind of protocol or something. Things are already getting complicated on the Beatrice Fairfax thread......I don't want to lie to you in a chat room! But I also want to enjoy this social network; it could be a good thing for us both, but how do we keep our boundaries up in cyberspace? It's a little different than being discreet at a party or rehersal or something.

OTOH, I'm glad you're reaching out to people. Your depression post makes me wonder if you're really as ok as you suggested last time you posted under the sign of the hanged man, but hang in there buddy! You need to get through this because I need you as a friend! I need you to be there when I start dating again so I can tell you all about my adventures and ask you about yours.

Glad you changed the spelling of "beleaguered" on your blog. I was getting tempted to message you about that, even though it's against the rules. Calliope was the muse of epic poetry, not music, though, but nice use of Sappho. Update your blog already. I need a hit.

Hola buddy-bud bud. Today on the way home I got Mike to tell me all about tensors. Of course I immediately started writing to you in my head before I remembered that I couldn't. I was trying to understand it in terms of our relationship-vector-space model, but I had to give that up pretty fast. Buddy, I want to geek out with you again.

I'm glad that what you miss most is just friendship. I guess I am getting to that place, too. But I also miss the intimacy, but maybe that's a part of friendship?

I'm glad too that we took this time off. We're going to feel so silly later! Such a little thing and we let it get blown all out of proportion. I think maybe our relationship in the future might be like exes who are good friends. I think I would be ok with that. I wish I could count on you for hugs and cuddling, but I guess the rational part of me realizes what a bad idea that is. But I'm looking forward to friendly hugs when we can have them again. We totally need to hang out more in person when we can, ok?

I realized today that I love you, and I'm really ok with that. It doesn't frighten me. For a moment I had clarity and I knew what I meant by "love" and I knew it applied to you. It's different from "in love" and I knew it because it had to do with really wanting what's best for you and with admiration and affection; I realize that I love a lot of people this way: my girlfriend, my sisters, many of my friends--probably all the people I really truly consider friends. JEF, E@UCSD come to mind. Also Anna-girl. and CC. many more; perhaps I will post them as I remember them.

I'm feeling a lot better. Your message that "whatever happens, never think, not even for a moment, that I don't care deeply about you and this friendship. I do, a great deal"--it took a while, but it finally sank in. I guess that was what I needed to hear. That very childish part of me needed to be reassured that you still cared about us. Thank you buddy. I love and miss you.

I'm dreaming of a day when we can safely snuggle up while watching a video or something. Wouldn't that be nice? On the other hand, if it were safe--if we didn't get excited--would that mean something was missing? I enjoy snuggling with my girlfriend very much, but it 98% of the time doesn't get me excited. You know what though, my answer right now is that I'd just be very glad if it could happen for us like that. I think even if we managed to "castrate" ourselves where the other is concerned, there still be a big pull and that would still make cuddling worthwhile.

I also imagine feeling your arm(s) around me, maybe as I'm falling asleep, but I know that's a lot less likely. And then today for a moment I imagined:
You woke up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom and you're stumbling your way back to bed now. You open the door and a path of light falls across the bed and my naked shoulders in it. You stand there for just a moment, admiring it.
Narcissistic, eh?

Ok, I wasn't going to admit to that reply unless/until you brought it up, but now I realize that's what your first post was about. So if that's what made you think I was mad, let me explain. The tone was my attempt to sound older and male-r and like someone who didn't know you. I guess somehow that translated into "more hostile."
Having said that, I must also admit that what I did was immature and stupid. In the last few days I have gotten in touch with some very irrational parts of my psyche and didn't think it was a good idea to repress, but I guess they went wild. I'm really sorry.

I *am* really glad to hear you're doing better. Really. I'm so proud of you, buddy.

And I guess in a way it's really really nice to see you enforcing a boundary and even calling me on it when I crossed. That's really reassuring and gives me hope for the future of our friendship. I know that's means I'm in a very childish place right now, sorry. But like I said before it didn't work for me to have to be the parent all the time.

I'm really looking forward to a time when it will be safe for us to be together again. I want to spend time with you; watch movies, listen to music, talk about things. And I want to be able to touch you. In the last few days I have just wanted you to hold me. I saw "Lost in Translation." (don't see it! at least not for a while). I miss you so much.

Of course I'm mad at you.
If I posted yesterday, it would have been to say that I hate you, which is not true, but I'm mad.

So I'll say it here. FUCK YOU.

Fuck you for being so perceptive. Fuck you for being the only person I could ever relate to who was "in love" with me WHATEVER THE FUCK THAT MEANS. Yes, I'm yelling. I am going to have an all-out Kausalya-style shit fit here if I feel like it.
What else? Oh yeah, Fuck you for saying you were in love with me; if you had tried that in person I would have covered your mouth before you'd gotten it out.

And most of all Fuck You for doing so well with these boundaries and for not missing me as much as I miss you even though you probably do but you're being a trooper and not letting it leak all over everything. Well, fuck you for being a trooper, too. Well I am somewhat glad; I was beginning to worry if you had an impulsivity problem. And I guess somewhere I do care about you too because somewhere I'm glad that your head is clearing and that you have some perspective. But I do still hope you divorce your wife and run away with me to Canada. I don't think we should get married, but we should definitely run away. My girlfriend and I are breaking up anyway; It'll be perfect.

Betty Berzon answered my letter. Not very helpful, but here it is.

Q Dear Dr. Berzon,

Please help if you can. I have a close, trusted friend with whom I share vigorous intellectual conversations and many common interests. Unfortunately, this friend and I have recently developed a deep mutual crush. The reason this is problematic is that (in addition to our fairly significant age difference) my friend is in a monogamous, long-term (10-plus years so far) relationship. I have been in a (theoretically) polyamorous relationship for two years, but have no intention of having an affair.

Although we have not so much as kissed, we find ourselves being more emotionally honest, and flirting and talking to each other about sex more and more. In addition, our physical contact has become more intense, though it has remained nonsexual. My friend is very committed to her partner and doesn't want to hurt her -- nor do I! We both do not want to have an affair because of the damage it would cause to her relationship as well as our friendship, and we are determined not to do so.

However, how do we get rid of the feelings we're having? I was encouraged by your letter to Tough Choices; you said "Long-term friendships are precious in our lives. They are not easy to come by. Work hard to hang on to this one, while clearing the air of any subterranean agendas that may have inadvertently developed."

This is what we want to do, but how? Can we keep our new emotional closeness? Should we stop contact? How can we "clear the air"?

Thank You,
Friend in Need
A Dear Friend in Need,

If you have no intention of having an affair with your friend, then don't. If you both are determined not to do damage to your existing relationships, then don't.

I understand that it is not quite that simple. Nor is it simple to "get rid" of the feelings and attraction you and she have for one another. Just because we are in committed relationships, we do not become immune to being attracted to other people. What matters is what we do, or don't do, about it. The idea of a commitment is just that, a "commitment" to each other to forgo acting on attractions outside the relationship.

Obviously you don't need a lecture on that issue. You already know what you need to know.

So how do you "clear the air"? Acknowledge that you care about one another and enjoy your close relationship. Talk more, flirt less. Don't tempt yourselves with talk of sex and a lot of physical contact. If you are going to be special friends, stick to that and you won't have to stop having the contact you both enjoy.

You both seem to have your heads in the right place. Stay there.

Found your blog today. Think you left it there for me to find. I've decided this one is going to be off limits to you; it'll be just for me and strangers that I won't get to know. I may sanitize a version for tribe.net (I think you must be one of the 3 visits to my profile; 1 i'm sure was spidra since I messaged her. was the other you? or me? or nobody?) and I'll post selections of it to our treehouse when we go back there.
Thought your blog was great. Wish I had a way of encouraging you to keep it up. Very creative and interesting.

btw, you know I had that color wheel idea first, right? Plus now I think it's more of a color solid.

I just might make a fake ID for Beatrix.

Scenario: we are at a convention in SF, maybe that comic convention I've got bookmarked. We walk around and look at things and talk and geek out. It's a little awkward; we can't really get into the convention because we're so into each other. I flirt with you; you flirt back. Finally we give up on it altogether and find somewhere to make out. It's not the first time, and it won't be the last. We're not ashamed, it's just fun and good-natured and we enjoy it so much, and since I'm writing this scenario somehow it works so that we don't have to feel guilty; we suspected this might happen today and it's ok that it did.
So anyway, let's say this pattern continues for a while and we do stuff together (movies, museums, flea markets, whatever) but we end up focusing on each other instead of what we're there to see. I guess eventually it would wear off? Or would it? Would it defeat the pull that brought us together in the first place? Do we really work better looking together at the same thing than looking directly at each other? It would be nice if that were true and if we felt it in our guts.
On the other hand, this complication could arise even without the making out--that would possibly make the awkwardness etc. worse. We might have to go through a phase like that, when we're trying to be friends and do things together but it's awkward. Will we get through it? How? I feel like if we start processing again we'll end up kind of where we are now.

Sometimes I wonder if you have an impulsivity problem. You buy things quickly; amazon etc are very dangerous for you. Impulsivity is strongly associated with addiction, but to your credit (as far as I know) you're not currently (or ever?) addicted to a substance. Are you in debt, though? Or maybe you manage your impulsivity so that you're not in debt, though perhaps the ends of months get tricky. Anyway, seeing impulsivity as a general quality about you makes me reconsider some of the impulsivity I've seen in you regarding our relationship. That is too say the fact that you're (or may be) impulsive about everything makes your quickness in confessing and jumping in and as you put it "driving through boundaries" easier to explain. Not sure it makes me feel any better (or worse) though.

I want to make a tribe.net ID unrelated to my real identity and post on the "Beatrix Fairfax" tribe and link to this blog, but I think there's too much identifying information. Well, maybe I'll make a bowdlerized blog? but then what if I got into a conversation with one of your friends--or worse you!--without that person knowing who I was and then when I met them at a party--well, is that rude or unethical?

Hey! I just found that I could still see if you're online (and vice versa) via tribe.net. Cool page, btw: combines friendster, craigslist, some other stuff...thanks for "turning me on." NPI NPI! So, is this a crack in the dam/wall? You know, everytime I go over to our bulletin board I am tempted to turn on the "who's online" bar. We could be both in there, looking at old posts and not able to see each other; invisible, like when "No Face" crosses the bridge in Spirited Away or something. Really, just more like we're both looking into a window but only seeing our own reflections. I wonder if this post is unhealthy?

I'm watching "Ask Alton" on the Good Eats ("Super Sweets") DVD; his mannerisms are really different when he's "out of character." It even seems like he has a slight accent that doesn't show up in the show. Must be weird to have a character with your own name. And Marsha's not even his real sister!
Did you notice any of this stuff when you were at his book signing?
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Last night I finally cried. I'm not sure how much was about you, but I don't think I would have if all of this wasn't going on. Do I feel better now? I don't know, but it is a relief to know that I still can cry that way. Odd, I thought I would be more relieved if I didn't have this grief or whatever, but I guess I knew I had it and I was just waiting for the other shoe to drop. Also, I feel like it confirms my suspicion that my feelings for you were non-trivial.
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In the last couple of days I have had that urge to run away with you--maybe to Canada? or New York? I didn't have that before, I think because I was trying to keep things realistic and find something workable. Now that I'm just talking to myself here, all those thoughts are free to roam.
But then again, without your actual input to contrast with my thoughts I don't know how much the person I want to run away with is some idealized impossible partner or spam made of bits of everyone I've "loved and lost." I do think some of these posts might be for that imaginary person, not just for you.

This is funny; not at all the kind of "mental foreplay" that you and I have a problem with.
http://www.mentalforeplay.com/

In other places on the web, Dan Savage (Savage Love 2.0) has this advice:

My boyfriend and I broke up after two years together. We had an amazing run with very few problems or issues, and it was quite difficult and painful to break up. I am in love, and he is too. The reason we broke up was because there was not a connection in bed. We loved sleeping together and spending every free moment together, but when it came to sex, it just was not happening.

Here is the rub: I'm miserable and miss him every moment. We tried to work on the sex thing, but it is just not a match. I'm lost and confused and miss the wonderful relationship. Is there a solution?

Madly in Love But Sexless

You and your boyfriend are what we advice professionals call ... friends. Since gay men, unlike straight men, draw their sex partners and their buddies from the same pool -- we're friends with other gay men, we date other gay men -- we sometimes mistake a platonic "best friends" attraction for a sexual "my one and only" attraction. Accept that you're not destined to be lovers -- be each other's best buddies. What else can you do?

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Not exactly our situation, but it does raise some interesting questions. How can a "best friends" attraction be so strong that it gets confused for that other kind of attraction? Or are they really different entities? What about Dione Warwick: "Friends can be lovers and lovers can be friends"?--just kidding, that opens its own can of worms (like "Does becoming a spokesperson for a psychic hotline detract from appreciation of your pop songs?").
Also, how does Dan suppose that process is accomplished, i.e. how can we "Accept that you're not destined to be lovers -- be each other's best buddies?"

I don't know if it's worse when I hurt, or when I don't. If I don't, does that mean nothing was real--as I have suspected at times it wasn't? Or does it mean I've lost the ability again?

From today's (rerun) Jon Carroll column:
"Right now, I'm listening to 1950s and '60s Sun Ra and thinking that it would be perfect for the soundtrack if they ever make movies out of James Ellroy's novels."

And that's your off-the-wall cross-cultural people-who-spend-too-much-time- in-their-brains moment for today. Tomorrow, mystery mondegreens, and so much more.

Is that us? Off-the-wall cross-cultural people-who-spend-too-much-time-in-their-brains?
Did you know on Sunday you referred to us as an "us"? I avoided that as much as I could.
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I feel so bad that I never got to (and now I probably never will) clarify what it was about your size that made it hard for me; there was no safe way to say it. Oh Buddy, it wasn't that I was put off by your size in itself; I'm not a 'no fat chicks' kind of person! How shallow did you think I was? It's just that when I imagine us together sometimes, suddenly I see you acting like other people I've know who were bigger and those particular people were rough and unskilled or at times violent. I know you wouldn't be like that.

The few times we did touch surprised me so much. I don't know why I expected your hands to be clammy, but they weren't. They were warm and soft and somehow transmitted such an energy to me, brief though our contacts were. Even when you were leaving the bar that time after the concert and all we had was an awkward handshake/high-five thing--such energy! That was new to me, buddy. I haven't gotten that from anyone before. How did you do it?

Buddy: I don't know if I hope more that you'll find this or that you won't. I guess when I figure out what the difference between "public" and "private" is in this place I might switch this to private.

I usually like Earth, Wind and Fire, but I didn't care much for that mp3 you sent me. I'll have to find out what the lyrics are; anyway if I listen to it 3 times I'll probably get it stuck in my head and start to like it. That's usually the way things are for me.

I googled you yesterday. Did you know that your namesake was responsible for a nautical first? Maybe I'll get you her book for xmas.
I didn't know you liked carnivorous plants--or gardening at all; I'm pretty sure you never mentioned this to me. Also, why didn't you ever send me a link to your web page? Did you not want me to see the part about your wedding(s)? I knew you were married; you knew that.